FPGA - DIY Programming The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are InFPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object FileFPGA programming, where to beginBest FPGA to work withCustom FPGA PCB with external programming circuitHow can I view, debug, or analyze data being input to my FPGA?Working on an FPGA without an IDEXilinx Programming FPGA from SPI Flash without JTAGWhy does this PIC18LF1220 program only two times and after that programming fails?Can't program multiple chips using JTAGSending SPI signals to the Flash Memory through verilog FPGA controller, but not receiving anything from it, why does it happens?How to estimate timing contraints for FPGAs?
Can a rogue use sneak attack with weapons that have the thrown property even if they are not thrown?
What tool would a Roman-age civilization have for the breaking of silver and other metals into dust?
Why can Shazam fly?
How are circuits which use complex ICs normally simulated?
Why do UK politicians seemingly ignore opinion polls on Brexit?
Is there a symbol for a right arrow with a square in the middle?
Button changing it's text & action. Good or terrible?
Multiply Two Integer Polynomials
How to manage monthly salary
Is flight data recorder erased after every flight?
What is the motivation for a law requiring 2 parties to consent for recording a conversation
Building a conditional check constraint
What are the motivations for publishing new editions of an existing textbook, beyond new discoveries in a field?
Why is the maximum length of OpenWrt’s root password 8 characters?
Why hard-Brexiteers don't insist on a hard border to prevent illegal immigration after Brexit?
Loose spokes after only a few rides
Shouldn't "much" here be used instead of "more"?
Scaling a graph of a circle and the standard parabola in TikZ
What to do when moving next to a bird sanctuary with a loosely-domesticated cat?
Resizing object distorts it (Illustrator CC 2018)
How to save as into a customized destination on macOS?
Can someone be penalized for an "unlawful" act if no penalty is specified?
Apparent duplicates between Haynes service instructions and MOT
Why isn't airport relocation done gradually?
FPGA - DIY Programming
The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are InFPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object FileFPGA programming, where to beginBest FPGA to work withCustom FPGA PCB with external programming circuitHow can I view, debug, or analyze data being input to my FPGA?Working on an FPGA without an IDEXilinx Programming FPGA from SPI Flash without JTAGWhy does this PIC18LF1220 program only two times and after that programming fails?Can't program multiple chips using JTAGSending SPI signals to the Flash Memory through verilog FPGA controller, but not receiving anything from it, why does it happens?How to estimate timing contraints for FPGAs?
.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;
$begingroup$
I've been programming microcontrollers for a few years now, and I've just discovered FPGA's after taking a digital design class. After doing some research into different FPGA's, development boards, etc, I'm still hesitant to buy any because I wouldn't know how to make my own version of the final "product." I've put PIC's, SAM's, AVR's, etc. on to custom PCB's with no issue, so I'm not worried about that--my main concern is programming an FPGA without a manufacturer's board.
My specific question: Would an FPGA function if I took the bitmap file generated by Quartus, Vivado, iCEcube, etc, wrote it to an SPI flash memory chip beginning at address 0 (say, via an FT2232H), and connected the flash memory to the SPI pins of an FPGA (with the MODE config set properly)?
I apologize for the partial hypothetical; I'm fairly sure that's all Lattice's Diamond Programmer does, but I wondered if that approach would work for FPGA's from different manufacturers, or whether say, Quartus added additional "window dressing" or headers to the memory while writing it.
Let me know if there's anything I can do to improve/clarify the question, or if I'm missing a big point in the FPGA programming process. Thanks!
fpga spi programming
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
$endgroup$
|
show 7 more comments
$begingroup$
I've been programming microcontrollers for a few years now, and I've just discovered FPGA's after taking a digital design class. After doing some research into different FPGA's, development boards, etc, I'm still hesitant to buy any because I wouldn't know how to make my own version of the final "product." I've put PIC's, SAM's, AVR's, etc. on to custom PCB's with no issue, so I'm not worried about that--my main concern is programming an FPGA without a manufacturer's board.
My specific question: Would an FPGA function if I took the bitmap file generated by Quartus, Vivado, iCEcube, etc, wrote it to an SPI flash memory chip beginning at address 0 (say, via an FT2232H), and connected the flash memory to the SPI pins of an FPGA (with the MODE config set properly)?
I apologize for the partial hypothetical; I'm fairly sure that's all Lattice's Diamond Programmer does, but I wondered if that approach would work for FPGA's from different manufacturers, or whether say, Quartus added additional "window dressing" or headers to the memory while writing it.
Let me know if there's anything I can do to improve/clarify the question, or if I'm missing a big point in the FPGA programming process. Thanks!
fpga spi programming
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
By "bitmap" you mean bit-stream?
$endgroup$
– Eugene Sh.
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
This question has be asked in a different incarnation before
$endgroup$
– laptop2d
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
On your first FPGA board design, I'd suggest to provide 2 methods of device programming (plus the vendor's JTAG header). Place jumper locations to allow you to change the MODE pins as needed. It's very easy to mess these up and it's good to have back-up plans. Also be sure to provide testpoints for INIT and DONE (or whatever Lattice uses to indicate the programming state).
$endgroup$
– The Photon
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
The process control required to mount BGAs, especially high pin count ones is tighter than something like a QFP. The fact there are more balls means there is a higher probability of bridging or bad connections and since they are hidden you won't be able to detect problems (unless you have an X-ray) prior to running the thing to see if you have any issues. And if you remount the component then you have to reball it which requires more equipement. FPGAs are also expensive chips that you don't want to damage. Large BGAs are where things like PCB preheaters become necessary.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
I used to work at a place where the techs did nothing but rework all day and they had hot air stations (tighter temperature control and more reliable than the heat gun) and they were unable to reliably hand solder BGAs. I don't think they had a preheater so if you are going to try it, get a preheater and use a cheap chip (maybe even daisy chain dummy BGA package so you can verify your connections electrically until you've nailed it before doing the real thing).
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
|
show 7 more comments
$begingroup$
I've been programming microcontrollers for a few years now, and I've just discovered FPGA's after taking a digital design class. After doing some research into different FPGA's, development boards, etc, I'm still hesitant to buy any because I wouldn't know how to make my own version of the final "product." I've put PIC's, SAM's, AVR's, etc. on to custom PCB's with no issue, so I'm not worried about that--my main concern is programming an FPGA without a manufacturer's board.
My specific question: Would an FPGA function if I took the bitmap file generated by Quartus, Vivado, iCEcube, etc, wrote it to an SPI flash memory chip beginning at address 0 (say, via an FT2232H), and connected the flash memory to the SPI pins of an FPGA (with the MODE config set properly)?
I apologize for the partial hypothetical; I'm fairly sure that's all Lattice's Diamond Programmer does, but I wondered if that approach would work for FPGA's from different manufacturers, or whether say, Quartus added additional "window dressing" or headers to the memory while writing it.
Let me know if there's anything I can do to improve/clarify the question, or if I'm missing a big point in the FPGA programming process. Thanks!
fpga spi programming
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
$endgroup$
I've been programming microcontrollers for a few years now, and I've just discovered FPGA's after taking a digital design class. After doing some research into different FPGA's, development boards, etc, I'm still hesitant to buy any because I wouldn't know how to make my own version of the final "product." I've put PIC's, SAM's, AVR's, etc. on to custom PCB's with no issue, so I'm not worried about that--my main concern is programming an FPGA without a manufacturer's board.
My specific question: Would an FPGA function if I took the bitmap file generated by Quartus, Vivado, iCEcube, etc, wrote it to an SPI flash memory chip beginning at address 0 (say, via an FT2232H), and connected the flash memory to the SPI pins of an FPGA (with the MODE config set properly)?
I apologize for the partial hypothetical; I'm fairly sure that's all Lattice's Diamond Programmer does, but I wondered if that approach would work for FPGA's from different manufacturers, or whether say, Quartus added additional "window dressing" or headers to the memory while writing it.
Let me know if there's anything I can do to improve/clarify the question, or if I'm missing a big point in the FPGA programming process. Thanks!
fpga spi programming
fpga spi programming
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
asked 5 hours ago
Blake LucasBlake Lucas
334
334
$begingroup$
By "bitmap" you mean bit-stream?
$endgroup$
– Eugene Sh.
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
This question has be asked in a different incarnation before
$endgroup$
– laptop2d
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
On your first FPGA board design, I'd suggest to provide 2 methods of device programming (plus the vendor's JTAG header). Place jumper locations to allow you to change the MODE pins as needed. It's very easy to mess these up and it's good to have back-up plans. Also be sure to provide testpoints for INIT and DONE (or whatever Lattice uses to indicate the programming state).
$endgroup$
– The Photon
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
The process control required to mount BGAs, especially high pin count ones is tighter than something like a QFP. The fact there are more balls means there is a higher probability of bridging or bad connections and since they are hidden you won't be able to detect problems (unless you have an X-ray) prior to running the thing to see if you have any issues. And if you remount the component then you have to reball it which requires more equipement. FPGAs are also expensive chips that you don't want to damage. Large BGAs are where things like PCB preheaters become necessary.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
I used to work at a place where the techs did nothing but rework all day and they had hot air stations (tighter temperature control and more reliable than the heat gun) and they were unable to reliably hand solder BGAs. I don't think they had a preheater so if you are going to try it, get a preheater and use a cheap chip (maybe even daisy chain dummy BGA package so you can verify your connections electrically until you've nailed it before doing the real thing).
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
|
show 7 more comments
$begingroup$
By "bitmap" you mean bit-stream?
$endgroup$
– Eugene Sh.
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
This question has be asked in a different incarnation before
$endgroup$
– laptop2d
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
On your first FPGA board design, I'd suggest to provide 2 methods of device programming (plus the vendor's JTAG header). Place jumper locations to allow you to change the MODE pins as needed. It's very easy to mess these up and it's good to have back-up plans. Also be sure to provide testpoints for INIT and DONE (or whatever Lattice uses to indicate the programming state).
$endgroup$
– The Photon
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
The process control required to mount BGAs, especially high pin count ones is tighter than something like a QFP. The fact there are more balls means there is a higher probability of bridging or bad connections and since they are hidden you won't be able to detect problems (unless you have an X-ray) prior to running the thing to see if you have any issues. And if you remount the component then you have to reball it which requires more equipement. FPGAs are also expensive chips that you don't want to damage. Large BGAs are where things like PCB preheaters become necessary.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
I used to work at a place where the techs did nothing but rework all day and they had hot air stations (tighter temperature control and more reliable than the heat gun) and they were unable to reliably hand solder BGAs. I don't think they had a preheater so if you are going to try it, get a preheater and use a cheap chip (maybe even daisy chain dummy BGA package so you can verify your connections electrically until you've nailed it before doing the real thing).
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
By "bitmap" you mean bit-stream?
$endgroup$
– Eugene Sh.
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
By "bitmap" you mean bit-stream?
$endgroup$
– Eugene Sh.
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
This question has be asked in a different incarnation before
$endgroup$
– laptop2d
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
This question has be asked in a different incarnation before
$endgroup$
– laptop2d
5 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
On your first FPGA board design, I'd suggest to provide 2 methods of device programming (plus the vendor's JTAG header). Place jumper locations to allow you to change the MODE pins as needed. It's very easy to mess these up and it's good to have back-up plans. Also be sure to provide testpoints for INIT and DONE (or whatever Lattice uses to indicate the programming state).
$endgroup$
– The Photon
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
On your first FPGA board design, I'd suggest to provide 2 methods of device programming (plus the vendor's JTAG header). Place jumper locations to allow you to change the MODE pins as needed. It's very easy to mess these up and it's good to have back-up plans. Also be sure to provide testpoints for INIT and DONE (or whatever Lattice uses to indicate the programming state).
$endgroup$
– The Photon
5 hours ago
2
2
$begingroup$
The process control required to mount BGAs, especially high pin count ones is tighter than something like a QFP. The fact there are more balls means there is a higher probability of bridging or bad connections and since they are hidden you won't be able to detect problems (unless you have an X-ray) prior to running the thing to see if you have any issues. And if you remount the component then you have to reball it which requires more equipement. FPGAs are also expensive chips that you don't want to damage. Large BGAs are where things like PCB preheaters become necessary.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
The process control required to mount BGAs, especially high pin count ones is tighter than something like a QFP. The fact there are more balls means there is a higher probability of bridging or bad connections and since they are hidden you won't be able to detect problems (unless you have an X-ray) prior to running the thing to see if you have any issues. And if you remount the component then you have to reball it which requires more equipement. FPGAs are also expensive chips that you don't want to damage. Large BGAs are where things like PCB preheaters become necessary.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
I used to work at a place where the techs did nothing but rework all day and they had hot air stations (tighter temperature control and more reliable than the heat gun) and they were unable to reliably hand solder BGAs. I don't think they had a preheater so if you are going to try it, get a preheater and use a cheap chip (maybe even daisy chain dummy BGA package so you can verify your connections electrically until you've nailed it before doing the real thing).
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
I used to work at a place where the techs did nothing but rework all day and they had hot air stations (tighter temperature control and more reliable than the heat gun) and they were unable to reliably hand solder BGAs. I don't think they had a preheater so if you are going to try it, get a preheater and use a cheap chip (maybe even daisy chain dummy BGA package so you can verify your connections electrically until you've nailed it before doing the real thing).
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
|
show 7 more comments
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Yes, it would work just fine.
Actually, the development tools for most FPGAs allow you to program the external flash directly through the FPGA's own JTAG connection, eliminating the need for a separate programming interface for the flash.
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When you say "the [sic] bitmap [sic] file generated by ", the answer is Yes as long as you pick the right one -- you made a slight error by using the definite article since there isn't just one file generated.
For example, Quartus can produce SOF, POF, and JIC files. The last one is what you use for indirect programming via the FPGA JTAG. It would not be useful to write that to the SPI flash. The SOF is for loading over JTAG to run your design in the FPGA transiently. POF is what you need to load into the flash chip.
See FPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object File for a lot of useful information on what the different files mean from each of the different vendors.
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
$endgroup$
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function ()
return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function ()
StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix)
StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["\$", "\$"]]);
);
);
, "mathjax-editing");
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function ()
return StackExchange.using("schematics", function ()
StackExchange.schematics.init();
);
, "cicuitlab");
StackExchange.ready(function()
var channelOptions =
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "135"
;
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
createEditor();
);
else
createEditor();
);
function createEditor()
StackExchange.prepareEditor(
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: false,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: null,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader:
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
,
onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
);
);
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2felectronics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f431856%2ffpga-diy-programming%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Yes, it would work just fine.
Actually, the development tools for most FPGAs allow you to program the external flash directly through the FPGA's own JTAG connection, eliminating the need for a separate programming interface for the flash.
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, it would work just fine.
Actually, the development tools for most FPGAs allow you to program the external flash directly through the FPGA's own JTAG connection, eliminating the need for a separate programming interface for the flash.
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes, it would work just fine.
Actually, the development tools for most FPGAs allow you to program the external flash directly through the FPGA's own JTAG connection, eliminating the need for a separate programming interface for the flash.
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
$endgroup$
Yes, it would work just fine.
Actually, the development tools for most FPGAs allow you to program the external flash directly through the FPGA's own JTAG connection, eliminating the need for a separate programming interface for the flash.
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
answered 5 hours ago
Dave Tweed♦Dave Tweed
124k10153267
124k10153267
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
And some, like Lattice Mach X02, have the flash on-board so you just need a few resistors and a 5x2 header to connect to the Lattice programming pod.
$endgroup$
– Spehro Pefhany
4 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
I was aware you can program the flash directly via JTAG from tools like Vivado/Quartus, what I was hoping was to be able to do it without needing to purchase a vendor-specific cable--just use an FT2232H and write the bitstream (not bitmap?) myself. I don't think that chip is supported by Quartus, though, and isn't openly supported by Vivado (even though they use it on the Nexys and Basys boards).
$endgroup$
– Blake Lucas
3 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
Yes, you can program the flash with the bit file using other means. One of your programmers for your MCUs can probably do it. I know my Segger J-link certainly can.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
@Toor: Indeed that's not a vendor-specific cable, but it still has hardcoded support in the vendor tools, and the Segger is quite a bit more expensive than a FT2232H.
$endgroup$
– Ben Voigt
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
$begingroup$
Pretty much all the major vendors provide engineering documentation to let the determined upload bitstreams to their parts (both FPGA and custom config flashes) with custom tools, because it is sometimes desirable in integrated systems or test rigs. It may be simplest to use the vendor's supported gear (especially at first), but I've implemented alternates for specific projects a number of times over the years. The harder part of an original FPGA board project may be all the support an FPGA needs on the board - lots of power pairs to route and bypass, often for several distinct voltages.
$endgroup$
– Chris Stratton
1 hour ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When you say "the [sic] bitmap [sic] file generated by ", the answer is Yes as long as you pick the right one -- you made a slight error by using the definite article since there isn't just one file generated.
For example, Quartus can produce SOF, POF, and JIC files. The last one is what you use for indirect programming via the FPGA JTAG. It would not be useful to write that to the SPI flash. The SOF is for loading over JTAG to run your design in the FPGA transiently. POF is what you need to load into the flash chip.
See FPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object File for a lot of useful information on what the different files mean from each of the different vendors.
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When you say "the [sic] bitmap [sic] file generated by ", the answer is Yes as long as you pick the right one -- you made a slight error by using the definite article since there isn't just one file generated.
For example, Quartus can produce SOF, POF, and JIC files. The last one is what you use for indirect programming via the FPGA JTAG. It would not be useful to write that to the SPI flash. The SOF is for loading over JTAG to run your design in the FPGA transiently. POF is what you need to load into the flash chip.
See FPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object File for a lot of useful information on what the different files mean from each of the different vendors.
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When you say "the [sic] bitmap [sic] file generated by ", the answer is Yes as long as you pick the right one -- you made a slight error by using the definite article since there isn't just one file generated.
For example, Quartus can produce SOF, POF, and JIC files. The last one is what you use for indirect programming via the FPGA JTAG. It would not be useful to write that to the SPI flash. The SOF is for loading over JTAG to run your design in the FPGA transiently. POF is what you need to load into the flash chip.
See FPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object File for a lot of useful information on what the different files mean from each of the different vendors.
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
$endgroup$
When you say "the [sic] bitmap [sic] file generated by ", the answer is Yes as long as you pick the right one -- you made a slight error by using the definite article since there isn't just one file generated.
For example, Quartus can produce SOF, POF, and JIC files. The last one is what you use for indirect programming via the FPGA JTAG. It would not be useful to write that to the SPI flash. The SOF is for loading over JTAG to run your design in the FPGA transiently. POF is what you need to load into the flash chip.
See FPGA: Bitstream vs. SRAM Object File for a lot of useful information on what the different files mean from each of the different vendors.
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
answered 1 hour ago
Ben VoigtBen Voigt
1,76611526
1,76611526
add a comment |
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Electrical Engineering Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2felectronics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f431856%2ffpga-diy-programming%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
$begingroup$
By "bitmap" you mean bit-stream?
$endgroup$
– Eugene Sh.
5 hours ago
$begingroup$
This question has be asked in a different incarnation before
$endgroup$
– laptop2d
5 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
On your first FPGA board design, I'd suggest to provide 2 methods of device programming (plus the vendor's JTAG header). Place jumper locations to allow you to change the MODE pins as needed. It's very easy to mess these up and it's good to have back-up plans. Also be sure to provide testpoints for INIT and DONE (or whatever Lattice uses to indicate the programming state).
$endgroup$
– The Photon
5 hours ago
2
$begingroup$
The process control required to mount BGAs, especially high pin count ones is tighter than something like a QFP. The fact there are more balls means there is a higher probability of bridging or bad connections and since they are hidden you won't be able to detect problems (unless you have an X-ray) prior to running the thing to see if you have any issues. And if you remount the component then you have to reball it which requires more equipement. FPGAs are also expensive chips that you don't want to damage. Large BGAs are where things like PCB preheaters become necessary.
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
I used to work at a place where the techs did nothing but rework all day and they had hot air stations (tighter temperature control and more reliable than the heat gun) and they were unable to reliably hand solder BGAs. I don't think they had a preheater so if you are going to try it, get a preheater and use a cheap chip (maybe even daisy chain dummy BGA package so you can verify your connections electrically until you've nailed it before doing the real thing).
$endgroup$
– Toor
3 hours ago