Planetary tidal locking causing asymetrical water distributionHow much water would remain at the poles of these planets?How can I catch an asteroid?Proxima Centauri and tidally locked planetsWhere on a tidally locked planet with a 25 °C maximum is the 0 °C isotherm?Tidal forces of tidally locked moon orbiting a gas giantWhat would wind currents and water cycle look like on a tidally locked planet?What's the longest plausible orbital period for a habitable planet with a 3:2 spin-orbit resonance?Could canals solve H G Wells Martians water shortage problems?Could these planetary circumstances occur?Is this model possible? Fast axial precession + tidal locking
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Planetary tidal locking causing asymetrical water distribution
How much water would remain at the poles of these planets?How can I catch an asteroid?Proxima Centauri and tidally locked planetsWhere on a tidally locked planet with a 25 °C maximum is the 0 °C isotherm?Tidal forces of tidally locked moon orbiting a gas giantWhat would wind currents and water cycle look like on a tidally locked planet?What's the longest plausible orbital period for a habitable planet with a 3:2 spin-orbit resonance?Could canals solve H G Wells Martians water shortage problems?Could these planetary circumstances occur?Is this model possible? Fast axial precession + tidal locking
$begingroup$
Imagine a planet of roughly the same size as Earth with the same amount of land, the same atmosphere and the same proportion of water (other planetary parameters may vary from Earth like) that has suddenly become gravitational locked so that one side always faces the sun.
Is there any scenario in which after a sufficiently long time large tracts of the ocean bed on the side facing the sun would be exposed to the atmosphere and all of the planets water would end up locked up in ice on the dark side? If so what special conditions would allow it and if not what processes would prevent this from happening?
science-based planets environment climate
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Imagine a planet of roughly the same size as Earth with the same amount of land, the same atmosphere and the same proportion of water (other planetary parameters may vary from Earth like) that has suddenly become gravitational locked so that one side always faces the sun.
Is there any scenario in which after a sufficiently long time large tracts of the ocean bed on the side facing the sun would be exposed to the atmosphere and all of the planets water would end up locked up in ice on the dark side? If so what special conditions would allow it and if not what processes would prevent this from happening?
science-based planets environment climate
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Cold trap (astronomy).
$endgroup$
– AlexP
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
physicsforums.com/threads/brown-dwarf-habitable-zones.875002 if you use a brown-dwarf in a binary star system to produce the tidal lock, it might be a place to start, maybe try placing the browndwarf+earth outside the habitable zone of the parent star. Though as the linked post suggests you'd likely find a great deal of 'rubble' close to the brown dwarf which, even if your planet had cleared it's own orbit, would help mitigate against any potential winds.
$endgroup$
– Giu Piete
8 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Imagine a planet of roughly the same size as Earth with the same amount of land, the same atmosphere and the same proportion of water (other planetary parameters may vary from Earth like) that has suddenly become gravitational locked so that one side always faces the sun.
Is there any scenario in which after a sufficiently long time large tracts of the ocean bed on the side facing the sun would be exposed to the atmosphere and all of the planets water would end up locked up in ice on the dark side? If so what special conditions would allow it and if not what processes would prevent this from happening?
science-based planets environment climate
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
$endgroup$
Imagine a planet of roughly the same size as Earth with the same amount of land, the same atmosphere and the same proportion of water (other planetary parameters may vary from Earth like) that has suddenly become gravitational locked so that one side always faces the sun.
Is there any scenario in which after a sufficiently long time large tracts of the ocean bed on the side facing the sun would be exposed to the atmosphere and all of the planets water would end up locked up in ice on the dark side? If so what special conditions would allow it and if not what processes would prevent this from happening?
science-based planets environment climate
science-based planets environment climate
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
asked 11 hours ago
SlartySlarty
11.1k42664
11.1k42664
$begingroup$
Cold trap (astronomy).
$endgroup$
– AlexP
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
physicsforums.com/threads/brown-dwarf-habitable-zones.875002 if you use a brown-dwarf in a binary star system to produce the tidal lock, it might be a place to start, maybe try placing the browndwarf+earth outside the habitable zone of the parent star. Though as the linked post suggests you'd likely find a great deal of 'rubble' close to the brown dwarf which, even if your planet had cleared it's own orbit, would help mitigate against any potential winds.
$endgroup$
– Giu Piete
8 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Cold trap (astronomy).
$endgroup$
– AlexP
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
physicsforums.com/threads/brown-dwarf-habitable-zones.875002 if you use a brown-dwarf in a binary star system to produce the tidal lock, it might be a place to start, maybe try placing the browndwarf+earth outside the habitable zone of the parent star. Though as the linked post suggests you'd likely find a great deal of 'rubble' close to the brown dwarf which, even if your planet had cleared it's own orbit, would help mitigate against any potential winds.
$endgroup$
– Giu Piete
8 hours ago
$begingroup$
Cold trap (astronomy).
$endgroup$
– AlexP
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
Cold trap (astronomy).
$endgroup$
– AlexP
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
physicsforums.com/threads/brown-dwarf-habitable-zones.875002 if you use a brown-dwarf in a binary star system to produce the tidal lock, it might be a place to start, maybe try placing the browndwarf+earth outside the habitable zone of the parent star. Though as the linked post suggests you'd likely find a great deal of 'rubble' close to the brown dwarf which, even if your planet had cleared it's own orbit, would help mitigate against any potential winds.
$endgroup$
– Giu Piete
8 hours ago
$begingroup$
physicsforums.com/threads/brown-dwarf-habitable-zones.875002 if you use a brown-dwarf in a binary star system to produce the tidal lock, it might be a place to start, maybe try placing the browndwarf+earth outside the habitable zone of the parent star. Though as the linked post suggests you'd likely find a great deal of 'rubble' close to the brown dwarf which, even if your planet had cleared it's own orbit, would help mitigate against any potential winds.
$endgroup$
– Giu Piete
8 hours ago
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Researchers have modeled this very question
See their Figure 1:
Apparently there are 3 relevant variables: less water, less geothermal heat flux, and more night-side continental area will increase the effect. Geothermal heat flux is how fast heat from the planet's core reaches the surface.
According to them, if earth became tidally locked, roughly half of the oceans would freeze. If you want to increase the effect with the same amount of water, simply change the other two variables: continents are more concentrated and end up on the night side, and they don't get much heat from the core.
And Now the Part Where I Ruin Your Day
However if the tidal locking is natural, this scenario has big problems. In order to move the habitable zone close enough to the star for tidal locking, it has to be a small red dwarf star. While long lived, young red dwarfs throw lots of huge magnetic and radiation flare tantrums. For a planet's atmosphere to not get blasted off during puberty, it has to have a very strong magnetic field -- think a fast or a huge electric generator. But unfortunately, tidally locked planets spin very slowly. That means you need a larger super-earth type planet to generate that field. You might be able to roll with that, but the kicker is that your powerful magnetic generator also makes a ton more geothermal heat to melt your ice. Maybe the planet's core is lined with space shuttle thermal tiles?
But Wait, It Gets Worse
A comment on another answer indicated a bigger question, about the ice cap swinging toward the sun. Unfortunately that's a no-go. Apart from the fact that surface water is only about 0.02% of the earth's mass, tidal forces relative to the center of the earth are actually away as well as toward:
In the left picture, imagine subtracting the center average arrow from the outside arrows to get the effect from earth's perspective. It's not quite as much on the backside, but the icecap still won't be interested in wandering past those side parts. Sorry pal.
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes -- this scenario is definitely possible. Climate models for tidally-locked planets find that for planets with relatively thin atmospheres with modest amounts of water, it can indeed all be trapped on the dark side of the planet as ice (technical references here and here).
With a bit more water or a bit thicker atmosphere you can have an Eyeball planet with enough water that the zone of permanent sunset/sunrise (what I called the "ring of life") can be quite pleasant. See here for an explanation of that type of hot Eyeball planet. There also exist cold Eyeball planets with lots of water (see here). A good candidate for an Eyeball planet is Proxima b.
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
add a comment |
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Researchers have modeled this very question
See their Figure 1:
Apparently there are 3 relevant variables: less water, less geothermal heat flux, and more night-side continental area will increase the effect. Geothermal heat flux is how fast heat from the planet's core reaches the surface.
According to them, if earth became tidally locked, roughly half of the oceans would freeze. If you want to increase the effect with the same amount of water, simply change the other two variables: continents are more concentrated and end up on the night side, and they don't get much heat from the core.
And Now the Part Where I Ruin Your Day
However if the tidal locking is natural, this scenario has big problems. In order to move the habitable zone close enough to the star for tidal locking, it has to be a small red dwarf star. While long lived, young red dwarfs throw lots of huge magnetic and radiation flare tantrums. For a planet's atmosphere to not get blasted off during puberty, it has to have a very strong magnetic field -- think a fast or a huge electric generator. But unfortunately, tidally locked planets spin very slowly. That means you need a larger super-earth type planet to generate that field. You might be able to roll with that, but the kicker is that your powerful magnetic generator also makes a ton more geothermal heat to melt your ice. Maybe the planet's core is lined with space shuttle thermal tiles?
But Wait, It Gets Worse
A comment on another answer indicated a bigger question, about the ice cap swinging toward the sun. Unfortunately that's a no-go. Apart from the fact that surface water is only about 0.02% of the earth's mass, tidal forces relative to the center of the earth are actually away as well as toward:
In the left picture, imagine subtracting the center average arrow from the outside arrows to get the effect from earth's perspective. It's not quite as much on the backside, but the icecap still won't be interested in wandering past those side parts. Sorry pal.
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Researchers have modeled this very question
See their Figure 1:
Apparently there are 3 relevant variables: less water, less geothermal heat flux, and more night-side continental area will increase the effect. Geothermal heat flux is how fast heat from the planet's core reaches the surface.
According to them, if earth became tidally locked, roughly half of the oceans would freeze. If you want to increase the effect with the same amount of water, simply change the other two variables: continents are more concentrated and end up on the night side, and they don't get much heat from the core.
And Now the Part Where I Ruin Your Day
However if the tidal locking is natural, this scenario has big problems. In order to move the habitable zone close enough to the star for tidal locking, it has to be a small red dwarf star. While long lived, young red dwarfs throw lots of huge magnetic and radiation flare tantrums. For a planet's atmosphere to not get blasted off during puberty, it has to have a very strong magnetic field -- think a fast or a huge electric generator. But unfortunately, tidally locked planets spin very slowly. That means you need a larger super-earth type planet to generate that field. You might be able to roll with that, but the kicker is that your powerful magnetic generator also makes a ton more geothermal heat to melt your ice. Maybe the planet's core is lined with space shuttle thermal tiles?
But Wait, It Gets Worse
A comment on another answer indicated a bigger question, about the ice cap swinging toward the sun. Unfortunately that's a no-go. Apart from the fact that surface water is only about 0.02% of the earth's mass, tidal forces relative to the center of the earth are actually away as well as toward:
In the left picture, imagine subtracting the center average arrow from the outside arrows to get the effect from earth's perspective. It's not quite as much on the backside, but the icecap still won't be interested in wandering past those side parts. Sorry pal.
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Researchers have modeled this very question
See their Figure 1:
Apparently there are 3 relevant variables: less water, less geothermal heat flux, and more night-side continental area will increase the effect. Geothermal heat flux is how fast heat from the planet's core reaches the surface.
According to them, if earth became tidally locked, roughly half of the oceans would freeze. If you want to increase the effect with the same amount of water, simply change the other two variables: continents are more concentrated and end up on the night side, and they don't get much heat from the core.
And Now the Part Where I Ruin Your Day
However if the tidal locking is natural, this scenario has big problems. In order to move the habitable zone close enough to the star for tidal locking, it has to be a small red dwarf star. While long lived, young red dwarfs throw lots of huge magnetic and radiation flare tantrums. For a planet's atmosphere to not get blasted off during puberty, it has to have a very strong magnetic field -- think a fast or a huge electric generator. But unfortunately, tidally locked planets spin very slowly. That means you need a larger super-earth type planet to generate that field. You might be able to roll with that, but the kicker is that your powerful magnetic generator also makes a ton more geothermal heat to melt your ice. Maybe the planet's core is lined with space shuttle thermal tiles?
But Wait, It Gets Worse
A comment on another answer indicated a bigger question, about the ice cap swinging toward the sun. Unfortunately that's a no-go. Apart from the fact that surface water is only about 0.02% of the earth's mass, tidal forces relative to the center of the earth are actually away as well as toward:
In the left picture, imagine subtracting the center average arrow from the outside arrows to get the effect from earth's perspective. It's not quite as much on the backside, but the icecap still won't be interested in wandering past those side parts. Sorry pal.
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
$endgroup$
Researchers have modeled this very question
See their Figure 1:
Apparently there are 3 relevant variables: less water, less geothermal heat flux, and more night-side continental area will increase the effect. Geothermal heat flux is how fast heat from the planet's core reaches the surface.
According to them, if earth became tidally locked, roughly half of the oceans would freeze. If you want to increase the effect with the same amount of water, simply change the other two variables: continents are more concentrated and end up on the night side, and they don't get much heat from the core.
And Now the Part Where I Ruin Your Day
However if the tidal locking is natural, this scenario has big problems. In order to move the habitable zone close enough to the star for tidal locking, it has to be a small red dwarf star. While long lived, young red dwarfs throw lots of huge magnetic and radiation flare tantrums. For a planet's atmosphere to not get blasted off during puberty, it has to have a very strong magnetic field -- think a fast or a huge electric generator. But unfortunately, tidally locked planets spin very slowly. That means you need a larger super-earth type planet to generate that field. You might be able to roll with that, but the kicker is that your powerful magnetic generator also makes a ton more geothermal heat to melt your ice. Maybe the planet's core is lined with space shuttle thermal tiles?
But Wait, It Gets Worse
A comment on another answer indicated a bigger question, about the ice cap swinging toward the sun. Unfortunately that's a no-go. Apart from the fact that surface water is only about 0.02% of the earth's mass, tidal forces relative to the center of the earth are actually away as well as toward:
In the left picture, imagine subtracting the center average arrow from the outside arrows to get the effect from earth's perspective. It's not quite as much on the backside, but the icecap still won't be interested in wandering past those side parts. Sorry pal.
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
answered 8 hours ago
BoomChuckBoomChuck
2,1071412
2,1071412
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
$begingroup$
If a pear shaped object was orbiting the sun which end would face the sun?
$endgroup$
– Slarty
6 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes -- this scenario is definitely possible. Climate models for tidally-locked planets find that for planets with relatively thin atmospheres with modest amounts of water, it can indeed all be trapped on the dark side of the planet as ice (technical references here and here).
With a bit more water or a bit thicker atmosphere you can have an Eyeball planet with enough water that the zone of permanent sunset/sunrise (what I called the "ring of life") can be quite pleasant. See here for an explanation of that type of hot Eyeball planet. There also exist cold Eyeball planets with lots of water (see here). A good candidate for an Eyeball planet is Proxima b.
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes -- this scenario is definitely possible. Climate models for tidally-locked planets find that for planets with relatively thin atmospheres with modest amounts of water, it can indeed all be trapped on the dark side of the planet as ice (technical references here and here).
With a bit more water or a bit thicker atmosphere you can have an Eyeball planet with enough water that the zone of permanent sunset/sunrise (what I called the "ring of life") can be quite pleasant. See here for an explanation of that type of hot Eyeball planet. There also exist cold Eyeball planets with lots of water (see here). A good candidate for an Eyeball planet is Proxima b.
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Yes -- this scenario is definitely possible. Climate models for tidally-locked planets find that for planets with relatively thin atmospheres with modest amounts of water, it can indeed all be trapped on the dark side of the planet as ice (technical references here and here).
With a bit more water or a bit thicker atmosphere you can have an Eyeball planet with enough water that the zone of permanent sunset/sunrise (what I called the "ring of life") can be quite pleasant. See here for an explanation of that type of hot Eyeball planet. There also exist cold Eyeball planets with lots of water (see here). A good candidate for an Eyeball planet is Proxima b.
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
$endgroup$
Yes -- this scenario is definitely possible. Climate models for tidally-locked planets find that for planets with relatively thin atmospheres with modest amounts of water, it can indeed all be trapped on the dark side of the planet as ice (technical references here and here).
With a bit more water or a bit thicker atmosphere you can have an Eyeball planet with enough water that the zone of permanent sunset/sunrise (what I called the "ring of life") can be quite pleasant. See here for an explanation of that type of hot Eyeball planet. There also exist cold Eyeball planets with lots of water (see here). A good candidate for an Eyeball planet is Proxima b.
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
answered 10 hours ago
Sean RaymondSean Raymond
3,071721
3,071721
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
1
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
$begingroup$
My concern would be for a planet with as much water as Earth that the huge ice build-up on the dark side would eventually destabilise the tidal locking causing the planet to "flip around" so the massive ice bulge faces the sun.
$endgroup$
– Slarty
10 hours ago
1
1
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
$begingroup$
@Slarty Tide pulls the near side in and the far side out, so it seems to me that such an asymmetry would reinforce the locking.
$endgroup$
– Anton Sherwood
8 hours ago
add a comment |
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Cold trap (astronomy).
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– AlexP
10 hours ago
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physicsforums.com/threads/brown-dwarf-habitable-zones.875002 if you use a brown-dwarf in a binary star system to produce the tidal lock, it might be a place to start, maybe try placing the browndwarf+earth outside the habitable zone of the parent star. Though as the linked post suggests you'd likely find a great deal of 'rubble' close to the brown dwarf which, even if your planet had cleared it's own orbit, would help mitigate against any potential winds.
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– Giu Piete
8 hours ago